Setting aside the immense degree of fantasy, wishful
thinking in that concept, it is interesting to recall that unmanned spotter
aircraft are not all that new. Just as
the Navy used DASH drones for ASW decades ago, so too US Navy battleships
(remember those?) used UAVs for gunfire spotting from the mid-1980’s through
the mid-2000’s. Of course, at that time
the UAVs were referred to as Remotely Piloted Vehicles (RPV). The RPV of choice was the RQ-2 Pioneer.
RQ-2 Pioneer |
As a reminder, the RQ-2 Pioneer was a mid-size, unmanned
aircraft that was launched via rocket assist or a small catapult from the ship’s
fantail and recovered using a net system.
It had an autopilot, inertial navigation, and 2-way C-band line-of-sight
data link with a range limit of 100 nm.(4)
A common payload was the Wescam DS-12 EO/IR (Electro-Optical/Infrared)
sensor.
Battleship and RPV - A Lethal Combination |
When not in use on the battleships, RPVs were disassembled
and stored in steel ‘blast boxes’ aft of the Number 3 turret.(8) The boxes were required to protect the units
from the extreme over-pressure of the 16” guns.
Here are some specs on the Pioneer.
RQ-2 Pioneer UAV Specs (2)
|
|
Number built
|
175
|
Deployment
|
1986 – 2007
|
Endurance
|
5 hr
|
Range
|
100 nm
|
Payload
|
75 lb
|
Dimensions
|
14 ft long x 17 ft wingspan
|
Ceiling
|
15,000 ft
|
Speed
|
110 kts
|
The USS Iowa became the test bed for the RQ-2 Pioneer in
December 1986. Iowa experimented with
RQ-2 Pioneer RPVs in 1987 exercises (Display Determination ’87) with Turkey and
managed to surreptitiously launched an RPV in spite of Turkey’s objections to
provide spotting support for a subsequent live fire event.(3)
RPV Launch |
The Marines obtained Pioneer aircraft in 1987 and operated
them from LHA amphibious ships as reconnaissance assets. Reportedly, 5 Austin class LPDs were also
equipped to operate Pioneers.(4)
Wisconsin and Missouri used their Pioneer RPVs to provide
reconnaissance during the 1991 Desert Storm conflict and participated in the
amphibious feint directed at the east coast of Kuwait.
After
Missouri’s initial sustained
shelling of the [Faylaka] island, Wisconsin
sent its Pioneer buzzing over Iraqi heads in preparation for another barrage,
during which Iraqi soldiers could be seen looking up blindly into the air
waving makeshift white flags signaling their surrender.
It
would be the first time an enemy surrendered to an unmanned vehicle and a
testament as to how brutally powerful the Battleships’ main battery were, even
in the modern era of so called “smart warfare.” (1)
During Wisconsin’s eight months in the Persian Gulf in
support of Desert Storm, she accumulated 348 RPV flight hours.(1) Including land based Marine units, Pioneers
flew 533 sorties during Desert Storm.(5)
Another report states that 30 Pioneers flew 858 combat sorties (2781
hrs).(6)
RPV In Recovery Net |
In 1998, Pioneer accumulated more than 300 at-sea
flight hours and was continuously deployed with cruises on USS Shreveport; USS
Denver; USS Austin; and USS Cleveland.(7)
While the Pioneer RPVs were quite successful, the main
takeaway from the Navy’s RPV experience is the operating environment and,
unfortunately, this lesson has not been recognized.
Permissive
Environment – It must be noted that the battleship’s RPVs were used in
permissive environments without aerial or surface-to-air threats. Thus, the RPVs were able to leisurely hover
over the target areas. This is the model
the Navy seems to believe in today. The
Navy makes absolutely no allowance for enemy resistance. Would we allow UAVs to leisurely circle over
our forces, sending back spotting information?
Of course not! So, why would the
enemy allow us to do that? They
won’t! Why then, are we so sure that
slow, non-stealthy UAVs will be the backbone of our battlefield surveillance
efforts? It makes no sense.
We’ve seen that the Saudis and Israel and even Iran
routinely shoot down UAVs. Why do we
think our UAVs will survive over a Chinese force? They won’t!
In fact, our UAV lifespans will likely be measured in seconds or, on a
good day, minutes.
Summary – So,
what does all this tell us? It tells us
that unmanned spotter – or, more generally, surveillance – UAVs can be a very
powerful tool but not as we plan to use them.
Loss rates under current planning will be near 100% and effectiveness,
in terms of surveillance, will be near zero.
The successful counter to this is numbers and, to a lesser degree,
stealth. If we flood an area with more
UAVs than the enemy can shoot down we’ll accomplish our surveillance
objectives. To do this requires cheap,
expendable UAVs that can be thrown into battle in large numbers combined with a
very robust master data assembly program that can put together the fragmentary
bits of data that are received before each UAV dies. The concept is described in this post: “PieceIt Together”. Here’s a closely related
post: “The Next Cruiser and Mini-Hawks”.
And: “UAVs – Numbers Matter”.
This discussion should also suggest the need for a UAV carrier capable of operating hundreds of small UAVs and managing their communications and data.
An excellent exercise would be for the Navy to send their
chosen UAVs to monitor an Army unit tasked with destroying the UAVs – a true
live fire exercise. Add in our best
efforts at disrupting the UAV communications and we’d have an exercise that
would tell us much about our UAV capabilities and our counter-UAV capabilities.
The Navy needs to get serious about determining the
survivability and effectiveness of UAVs in a peer combat scenario before we
commit them to war. UAVs are the
foundation of so many of our plans and yet we have no evidence to suggest that
they are survivable or effective in combat.
In fact, operational experience strongly demonstrates that they are
neither survivable nor effective.
(1)“Battleships Pulled Off The Biggest Ruse Of Operation
Desert Storm 25 Years Ago”, Tyler Rogoway, 20-Jan-2016,
https://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/battleships-pulled-off-the-biggest-ruse-of-operation-de-1754104974
Maybe unmanned aerial loitering systems are what we should be using on ships. The IDF already does. UVision has a whole family of loitering drones, the Hero family. All of them are tube launched from small Hero 20 to the large Hero 1250 (250km range, 30 kg warhead, 7hr loiter). you could pack a bunch into something like the old ASROC launcher. Would be a lot cheaper than operating Helicopters and take up less space.At the end of the mission it can attack the target or if no target, self destruct. They would be considered munitions rounds, just like all the other ammo on board.
ReplyDeleteI always thought a drone made on the type of air frame of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vought_XF5U would be a great carrier drone aircraft. very fast top speed, long range damned strong, insanely short take off and landing. Something like that for a modern heavy gun cruiser or BB would be awesome. Or really for anyone.
ReplyDelete@James
ReplyDeleteI always thought the demise of the flying pancake was premature...
"An excellent exercise would be for the Navy to send their chosen UAVs to monitor an Army unit tasked with destroying the UAVs – a true live fire exercise. Add in our best efforts at disrupting the UAV communications and we’d have an exercise that would tell us much about our UAV capabilities and our counter-UAV capabilities."
ReplyDeleteExactly the kind of thing we need to be doing. Find out if these things work or not.
We need more realistic training across the board.
Of course, the problem is that there are a whole lot of careers invested in a lot of these gadgets, and if they don't work then a lot of those careers go down the drain. Better careers now, than lives later when it counts for real.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteIts still really good to read the posts and the ensuing discussions. ComNavOps could be 7 year old kid posting from the family computer when his mum gives him time for all i care.
DeleteThe problem with USN is they learned the wrong lessons during GW1: USN thinks the Iraqis surrendered to an UAV when in reality, Iraqis were getting pulverized by 16 inches rounds and said no mas....its not the same thing!
ReplyDeleteYes, the UAV was simply the first thing they saw that they could surrender to.
DeleteI completely agree that they buried the lead with the surrender. It was the power of the shelling that convinced the troops not to fight. The UAV could have been a 9 year old on a bicycle with a phone to HQ and the result would have been the same.
DeleteWhile the story of surrendering to a UAV is compelling, how did it actually happen? Was The UAV able to secure the event weapons and process the prisoners? Was it able to gain useful intelligence from the captives? There is no replacement for actual presence on the battlefield. Unmammed assets can provide useful information on the battlefield situation and deliver weapons to have some effect, but they are limited compared with actual soldiers or sailors. Even if this was an unmanned tank, the result would be the same - enemy troops acting for the camera, but no was for the robot to peacefully resolve the situation. Robots are useful but humans are irreplaceable in terms of flexibility of programming.
I think small, relatively cheap, unmanned systems may be useful for intel, recon, and surveillance. But trying to replace ships with larger unmanned systems is lunacy.
ReplyDeleteAnd if you're going to use them for intel, recon, and surveillance, you better have a bunch of them because your expected loss rate is going to be high, and they'd better be cheap because you're going to go through a lot of them.
The Navy needs to buck up and realize that they're not going to be able to get along without sailors any time soon, and any harebrained notion that they can utilize unmanned vehicles to eliminate the need for humans is nuts. Use them to complement humans, and have backups available if and when they fail.
CDR: Exactly what I've been trying to post for the past 2 hours but crazy work right now!
DeleteFINALLY some down time. My post:
During Cold War, US forces were sharp and focused, I can see why they felt an UAV wasn't needed, what did it provide the numerous manned recon assets we operated then couldn't? The capability wasn't that much better,maybe little more persistence but thats about it and USN realized UAVs wouldn't last long vs Soviets.
Today, we dont have any manned capability left so we need UAVs which is OK if we bought them, operated them and understood the consequences correctly, which we haven't!!!
We need to buy cheap, plentiful and rapidly produced UAVs, we need to understand the strength and weaknesses and train in accordance and even sometimes, blasphemy, operate with out them!!! Today, US forces buy just a few UAVS, operate them 24-7, almost no shoot downs and think we can afford the losses. Plus, we have now a military that has forgotten one of the most important lessons: war is full of fog and darkness and we think we have magically removed it. Our forces have become way to used to having an all seeing eye in the sky and the reality check will be brutal.
What we need to practice is a few minutes to a few seconds! of coverage then operate for a FEW HOURS without coverage, maybe even go a day with no coverage, then again a rapid glimpse and go back to no coverage....same really goes to GPS and communications, maybe in the future, would even apply to AI, get a quick run down, data dump, some instructions or guidelines from the CO-AI assistant and go back to complete black out from all EM emissions/receptions. That's far more possible and what would happen in a real war against China. Thats reality.
I think the navy needs to invest in making the UAVs themselves. Fit ships with 3D printers for the bodies - even engines can now be printed for very small UAVs and this technology will improve. All you'd need would be the sensor packages and chunks of that can be printed too. That's the route to mass, cheap drone swarms.
ReplyDeleteMass, cheap, locally produced drones would have to be very small, very limited in flight range, very limited in sensor range, and have very small payloads. What combat use do you see for such a drone?
DeleteFor an infantryman, it would be useful to look over the next hill or behind the next building. For a ship that can already see 15 miles to the horizon with its own radar, what does a very small UAV gain the ship?
Not saying it's a bad idea but the idea needs to be carefully thought through to make sure it's combat-useful.
Didn't USMC had a similar program already? Haven't much since they tried it after years back, ill have to google it up....i guess it sounds like a good idea but is it really that practical and better than just outright buying them already made?
DeleteFor a repair capability, I see the benefits of printing small parts that may be difficult to stock on board and that may break often. But for the initial platform, I don't see the advantage in waiting to produce the asset during a mission, versus having it already available.
DeleteRecently, a suspected Chinese Navy bid document published online showing China's proposed new type 076 amphibious assault ship. It has two electrical magnetic eject systems mainly for launch drones. It could become first drone carrier (if no maned helicopter).
ReplyDeleteIts GJ-11 displayed during last October's military parade is the first stealthy attacking drone entered military service in the world (not in development but in service).
This idea could bridge a problem of supporting marine because China has no F-35B.