Saturday, September 27, 2014

New Frigate Design

As the Navy works to settle on its new LCS new small surface combatant design, ComNavOps offers this conceptual possibility for a frigate sized ship.

Length:  376 ft
Displacement:  2500 tons
Range:  5500 miles at 15 kts
Speed:  36.5 kts
Armor:  ¾” – 1” high strength steel with 1” – 2” armor around weapon mounts

5 x 5” guns
7 x 25mm guns
6 x SeaRam
8 Harpoon

It’s about the same size as an LCS, just as fast, better range, well armored, very survivable, and well armed for its role.  What do you think? 


  1. Steam or gas turbines for the engines?

    Oh and a fairly good diagram of the class too:

  2. What will the guidance and target tracking of the cannons will be ?
    Will every turret have a crew , or will the fire solurions be generated by software?
    You've put more barrels than you need on that boat.
    Less barrels but with more smart amunnition would be the solution.

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  4. Looks like you are concentrating on gun based firepower, are you talking five 5 inch guns in single turrets? A lot for such a small ship.

    If want to pack this kind of firepower in a ship this small would three twin turrets be a better solution?


  5. I think CNO is trying to be cutie by implying that Fletcher class is superior to the LCS, but after reading about loses to WWII destroyers used to close fire support during that war, I sure would not want to sail one close enough to shore for a 5in 38cal. to hit something.

    An why does he use only 6 RAM missiles? SeaRam carriers 11 missile and Mk 149 carrier 21 missile. And what type of 25mm gun, Bushmaster, Gepard, or the Japanese 25mm from WWII?

  6. The new South Korean FFX Batch II, first of eight planned contract signed with Daewoo for first $306M Dec. 2013
    Details sketchy and very provisional details as I understand.
    Full load displacement 3,500t ? (Batch I Incheon Class 3,250t , range 8000km/ 5000 miles ), full electric propulsion to be supplied by DRS, presumably based on the 36.5MW permanent magnet motor designed for Zumwalt with RR MT30 GT and MTU diesel engines.
    A hanger able to take helicopters up to 10t, large enough for the KUH ASW Surion, or the AW159 Wildcat maritime version, 8 ordered.
    BAE 127mm Mk45 main gun, the Hyundai Wic 40mm, round based on BAE 3P for CIWS
    Sixteen K-VLS
    AA missile the LIGNex1 SAAM-X dual active homing, spec to hit JDAM & sea skimming missiles at 15km
    ASuW Hae Sung 1 718kg 150km range/ mark subsonic, talk of a development of the newer Hae Sung II 500km range Mach 1+ land attack modified for anti ship.
    ASW The Red Shark VL missile developed by the University of Science Technology and Korean Agency for Defence Development(ADD) for $80m !, 820kg, 19km(12 miles) range with TVC motor, drops Blue Shark torpedo by parachute.
    Wildcat helicopter fitted with anti-ship missiles, torpedoes and a door-mounted gun, an active dipping sonar, 360° scan radar, nose-mounted EO/IR device and a rescue hoist, same fit expected on Surion.
    AESA surveillance radar by LIGNex1 and fire control radar by Samsung Thales plus EOTS, Sonata jamming system & MASS
    Towed array active sensor system for long range detection of submarines and ships plus line array for torpedo alert system developed by Hanwha.

    Source mainly Ambassador on Military Photos


    1. Nick, how would you evaluate this frigate relative to the premise in the "New Frigate Design - Part 2"?

  7. Nick, how would you evaluate this frigate relative to the premise in the "New Frigate Design - Part 2"?

    I do agree with your sentiments on armour and weapon load.
    The Soviet era warships carried much higher density of missiles partly due minimal space for crew but also they used the cold launch instead of the hot launch system of the MK 41 and MK 57 VLS. If I have my figures right an eight cell strike length MK41 takes up 1,786 cu. ft. and the MK 57 four cell 2,658 cu.ft., part of the reason the 'destroyer' Zumwalt is so large, the Captain James Kirk is quoted as saying nearly 16,000 tons.
    The failure of the western navies to upgrade to 155mm guns was disappointing, the Rheinmetell naval gun failed due to technical problems, unusual for the Germans, and the BAE 155mm/52 for the Royal Navy cancelled in the infamous 2010 Defence Review. The 155mm shell would have given commonality with the army and all the associated benefits in cost, production and design. The effectiveness of NGFS is the amount of explosives you can land on target, approx. figures seen on web are 5” 7 +lbs/155mm 23+ lbs.
    With regard to missiles I am more hopeful than you the new generation will full fill their promise and success rate after the years and $billons invested eg the Raytheon's RAM Block 2, ESSM active seeker, SM-6 with the AMRAAM active RF seeker, Konsberg's NSM, Lockheed's LRSAM with the BAE seeker which DARPA were so keen on.
    What continues to fall short across the military is software and the need to write another million lines of code and the associated $million+ cost. One interesting item seen on engadget was Google's automatic object recognition in images. Though computer power, smart algorithms and human help objects get missed. Google can now easily spot objects even if partly obscured using neural network that can rapidly refine criteria without a lot of extra computing power allowing far deeper scanning and make better guesses, a basic with their self driving cars if they don't want to be sued. Why I mention this is you can see an immediate crossover to radar, sonar and EO/IR in both surveillance and seeker modes.

  8. I'll like to re-iterate my well hashed assertion that the Navy does not need more over sized gunboats and it does not need any more Burkes. I have been saying that the Navy should build about 40~60, true multi-role frigate, which inherits DDG1000 and DDG51 Flight III components. Such a vessel can be as follows:-

    Displacement: 5000 tons
    Crew: ~140 officers + enlisted
    Powerplant: 1 x 42MW LM6000 Turbine Generator + 2 x 7MW Diesel Generators (56MW) -- 8000 nm @ 12 MW
    Propulsion: Azipod XC contra-rotating podded propulsors 2 x 25MW (COTS) -- 30 knots
    Radar: 3 x SPY-3 or 3 x AMDR-X only (no long range VSR)
    Sonar: SQS-61 High Frequency + SQR-20 Towed Array
    Gun: 1 x 57mm/L70 Mk110 mod(2) LO mount + 1 x 25mm Mk38 mod(2) retractable mount
    Missiles: 24 x Mk57 VLS (Typically: 8 x LRASM + 8 x VL-ASROC + 32 x ESSM)
    Torpedo: 2 x twin Mk32 324mm amidships torpedo tubes
    Aircraft: 1 x MH-60R Seahawk + 1 x RQ-8 Firescout


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