tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post2944082031833359420..comments2024-03-28T02:26:00.323-07:00Comments on Navy Matters: Deja Vu?ComNavOpshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09669644332369727431noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-15526846167323651172013-12-21T22:08:15.518-08:002013-12-21T22:08:15.518-08:00ComNavOps,
I agree!
GABComNavOps,<br /><br />I agree!<br /><br />GABAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-46285659281811370462013-12-19T03:44:27.926-08:002013-12-19T03:44:27.926-08:00GAB,
Everything I've read about the Hainan Is...GAB,<br /><br />Everything I've read about the Hainan Island incident indicates that it was a 'hot dog' fighter pilot who played a little too close. <br /><br />We've (probably) been flying similar airborne ISR missions for the last decade plus and there's no record of a similar collision. One can surmise that ramming is probably not PLA intercept doctrine.<br /><br />Regardless - causing an intentional collision between two aircraft is a lot harder than you might imagine. Particularly if the one aircraft doesn't want to be hit. The EP-3 was not particularly well know for its nimbleness or acceleration. The P-8A is.<br /><br />Matt<br /><br />PS- Comparing size based on maximum gross weights of the P-8A and EP-3 is erroneous. P-8A max includes weapons and stores which aren't typically carried on an ISR mission. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-89368691613644146432013-12-18T19:04:05.821-08:002013-12-18T19:04:05.821-08:00GAB, the actual collision may or may not have been...GAB, the actual collision may or may not have been a fluke. More importantly, though, the violation of flight procedures in international air space was not a fluke. The subsequent seizure and stripping of the aircraft was not a fluke. The pattern of harassing US ships and aircraft is not a fluke. The post is a suggestion that the pattern of harassment will likely continue and the likelihood of a similar incident is, thus, high. Hopefully, we're better prepared with combat support next time or we'll be watching the Chinese strip a brand new P-8 while we fire off strongly worded protests.ComNavOpshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09669644332369727431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-6934054935577368992013-12-18T18:58:07.817-08:002013-12-18T18:58:07.817-08:00An inappropriate comment was removed. Discuss the...An inappropriate comment was removed. Discuss the idea, not the person.ComNavOpshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09669644332369727431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-44955238122879715762013-12-17T05:34:27.159-08:002013-12-17T05:34:27.159-08:00"EP-3 and P-8A are about the same size."..."EP-3 and P-8A are about the same size."<br />xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<br />Wrong.<br /><br />A P-8 is a much larger aircraft.<br /><br />Empty a P-8 is almost twice the weight of a P-3. Loaded:<br /><br />EP-3 has a max. takeoff weight of 142,000 lb (64,400 kg) <br /><br />A P-8 has a max. takeoff weight of 189,200 lb (85,820 kg) <br /><br />Pretty big difference.<br /><br />And the Chinese version of chicken includes contact.<br />Since you are not going to outmanuever a fighter in a patrol aircraft, mass matters.<br /><br />GABAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-64545744501606158922013-12-14T04:15:02.598-08:002013-12-14T04:15:02.598-08:00GAB,
EP-3 and P-8A are about the same size. And ...GAB,<br /><br />EP-3 and P-8A are about the same size. And air combat -- even of the 'chicken' variety -- is really more about nimbleness than mass. <br /><br />The Hainan Island incident speaks very strongly as to why we need long-dwell UAS. A BAMS or Global Hawk is a lot less riskier than using a P-8A (9-10 crew) or an EP-3 (20+ crew). <br /><br />MattAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-5856725003320276602013-12-13T16:13:20.758-08:002013-12-13T16:13:20.758-08:00The problem with the EP-3 was that it was too heav...The problem with the EP-3 was that it was too heavy and slow to run from an interceptor. The P-8A is quite a bit faster than EP-3 and has a much higher service ceiling.<br /><br />I am not saying a P-8A can win a tail-chase with a supersonic fighter -- but given sufficient warning, it has a much greater probability of escaping to friendly air cover.<br /><br />MattAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5579907756656776056.post-30757799095725368292013-12-10T05:40:23.730-08:002013-12-10T05:40:23.730-08:00I think the EP-3 incident was a a fluke as a resul...I think the EP-3 incident was a a fluke as a result of the PLAA pilot trying to play chicken.<br /><br />The B-52 was probably selected for the ADIZ overflight because it is a big, rugged plane - not easy to physically push around by a fighter.<br /><br />Likewis a P-8 is a really large aircraft, and likely immune to attempts to physically push around.<br /><br />GABAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com